Pen Vs Dmg Vs Critd

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Jan 28, 2018  Olympus Pen F vs. Jun 17, 2016 Hello everyone, I made a post a few weeks back in regards to getting a Fuji X-Pro 2 vs. An Olympus Pen-F.after handling both cameras, I think I've decided to go with the Olympus. They just seem so much snappier with many more features packed inside of them, plus they have small and light lenses which. Mar 31, 2019 A no-frills damage comparison between M.Atk and M.Pen and more! Subscribe for more vids on Ragnarok Eternal Love! #ragnarok #ragnaroketernal #RagnarokMEternalLove #ragnarokmobile #ro #.

Critd

Pen Vs Dmg Vs Crit 2016

Dmg

Pen Vs Dmg Vs Crit Build

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Pen Vs Dmg Vs Crit 3

  1. Def Pen is skewed in this scenerio and is highly favoured over ATK and CritDmg. This is due to Def Pen being lowered if you are under-leveled vs. The mobs from the damage equation. EDIT: Updated guide with new tested values from Lv80 Annette.
  2. If its a well equipped Romulan with CH of 30% + various in game boosts then crid will out perform dmg. Critd vs pen, is a different matter as the damage boosting effectiveness of pen is, I believe, dependant of the target's damage resistance. The calculation for critD vs damage is simple enough.

Pen Vs Dmg Vs Crit 2

Pen vs dmg vs crit 2017

Pen Vs Dmg Vs Crit Pro

  • edited May 2016
    STO Member since February 2009.
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  • edited May 2016
    Right now it is Pen, Dmg and then CrtD.
    So an AP beam array with Pen and Dmgx3 is the way to go right now, for pve.
    Tomorrow it might be different..
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  • oopsie...
    Guess I should have read the OP before posting...
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  • The-Grand-Nagus
    Join Date: Sep 2008
  • oopsie...
    Guess I should have read the OP before posting...

    Many say that to me about instructions.......just after the fire and police arrives.

    Does the 'fire' come alone, or does it bring it's own Firemen with it?
    STO Member since February 2009.
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  • Yes I want a Phaser Beam Array Mk XIV [Trendy]x4.
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  • Yes I want a Phaser Beam Array Mk XIV [Trendy]x4.

    Now imagine that with FAW...
    STO Member since February 2009.
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    Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
  • Yes I want a Phaser Beam Array Mk XIV [Trendy]x4.

    Now imagine that with FAW...

    or overload.... [doing the math... pales at the destruction of the known universe]

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  • Pen is the best mod
    2nd is DMG or CrtD depending on if u r romulan or fed/kdf
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  • Why...??
    It's all just silly fun, nobody has posted a thing that would warrant a lock.
    And my first post was in error because I didn't take a moment to actually read the OP.
    STO Member since February 2009.
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  • Yes I want a Phaser Beam Array Mk XIV [Trendy]x4.

    Now imagine that with FAW...

    The good thing about that mod is it procs ban hammers with 100% shield penetration. That's pretty high Deeps.
    The bad thing about that mod is, it shuts down your ability to chat. Might be a bug, but haven't heard from Bort or not if it's intended.
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  • Damaged buffed months ago, making those dmg*3 CritD ultra weapons a pretty attractive.
    Dmg vs critD depends on getting your critD or critH really high in combat, which can be a lot higher than the crits you do on paper when parked.
    Things like:
    weapon doffs can stack to 30%CD or 3%CH
    Feedback pulse starship trait from krenim sci +10CH and 50%CD
    Strategist 3%ch 20%cd
    + any number of abilities, traits, set bonuses etc
    Acc overflow if not FAWing
    For example if your crit H can get to say 45%, a 20% CD is much better than 3% damage. You probably won't be able to sustain 45% crits for any weapon, but can dip into it, now its a matter of educated guess work and testing.
    Getting those really high crits may involve:
    Grinding set gear
    Having the the right starshiptraits and possibly the good fortune to have a ship like the krenim sci
    Buying expensive stuff on the exchange
    Getting lucky with crit boosts that have a %chance to proc or require enemies to fire at you
    Making build compromises in order to do more damage
  • Ya but the new science ultimate sets your critical chance to 50%
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  • Yang Xiao Long wrote:
    I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
    The nut who actually ground out a Delta Pack, Temporal Pack, and Gamma Pack
    The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
  • edited May 2016
    What about the [Pen] mod on torps ?
    Does a Torp user want that ^
    And does the Torp user prefer CrtD, CrtH or Dmg ?
    /back on topic; Thread Save
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  • Right now it depends on your career. If you're tac, then [Dmg] is best. If you're sci or eng, then [CrtD] is best. I think this has something to do with innate tac bonuses making [Dmg] better for tacs, but without that, then you're better off with [CrtD].

    Support 90 degree arc limitation on BFaW! Save our ships from looking like flying disco balls of dumb!
  • Right now it depends on your career. If you're tac, then [Dmg] is best. If you're sci or eng, then [CrtD] is best. I think this has something to do with innate tac bonuses making [Dmg] better for tacs, but without that, then you're better off with [CrtD].

    This right here. I am wondering though if the Pen vs CrtD follows something similar. I know they math guys tested Pen vs CrtD, but I think (don't know for sure) that they only tested with Tac Captains. I wonder if they tested with Eng and Sci Captains as well. I use Eng Captains and I just haven't seen much difference when using CrtDx4 or CrtDx3 Pen.
    'I'm not big on telepaths myself. I'm not big on guns either. But if everyone else has them, I want to make sure I can get my hands on the biggest one I can.'
  • If its a well equipped Romulan with CH of 30% + various in game boosts then crid will out perform dmg. Critd vs pen, is a different matter as the damage boosting effectiveness of pen is, I believe, dependant of the target's damage resistance.
    the calculation for critD vs damage is simple enough.
    Expected damage is: ((1+critd. chance of crit).your damage figure) + ((1-crit hit chance).your damage figure)*
    Run calc with what you have +20% critD and the run it with the old values multiplied by 1.03, whichever is best is best for you until something changes, like doing the Strategist spec or buying crit boosting doffs etc.
    Tac capt have alpha strike that adds 5% crits plus critd and damage with each activation, a tac capt with AHOD can do that more often than one without, looks to me that they'd often be best going for critD.
    My guess would be that for high CritH builds, critDx3 will out perform Critdx2 plus pen, for most situations, dps ISA runs are not 'most situations'. This could be wrong.
    The magnitude of 'best' is not necessarily that much. Similar applies to beam type.
    *In the case of a rom alt of mine, critD is clearly better than dmg, though what I'm prepared to pay for is another issue as critDx3 weapons are often stupidly expensive.
  • Just did a solo test run on the new foundry dps testing level, and the toon mentioned above hit 44% crits, its obvious that critD trumps dmg in that case.
  • edited May 2016
    I will go against the trend favoring the [Pen] mod and provide a different view that you may or may not disagree with. However, I will admit that what I am about to say is more based on the tooltip descriptions that we know can sometimes be flawed, and from my own observation where the power of empirical research is highly subjective. Do note that I look at things primarily from a programmer's perspective and how formulas work and that my findings or reasoning is not based on numerous parsing tools that may or may not provide the correct data (which is why I mostly avoid relying on that data alone). So here we go:
    The [DMG] mod provides a solid and consistent damage boost. It has the least amount of variables and parameters involved, so if you are looking for a modifier that you can always rely on then this is the mod for you.
    The [CrtD] relies on a second parameter, namely the [CrtH] mod or critical chance to be fully useful. However, unlike the [Pen] mod critical damage will always apply when it triggers, whether that is against shield or hull unless some form of immunity occurs.
    The [Pen] is a solid damage boost when it actually triggers. However, it is not entirely consistent because it also relies on a second parameter. Namely the existence or non-existence of shields. Unlike [CritD] that will apply against shields when it triggers, the [Pen] only works against hull. It is also important to note that the tooltip for weapons says it ignores 10 Armor Rating, or -10 rating. Whether this translates to an actual 10% armor penetration or a flat reduction of 10 in rating I do not know and I have not done any testing. If the first scenario is the case then the [Pen] mod is extremely useful... when it triggers. But if the latter is the case, then the [Pen] mod is misunderstood resulting in an overrated and overestimated expectation. I will explain why.
    Resistance rating or armor rating has diminishing returns. What that means is that the lower the target's innate armor rating is, the more efficient the [Pen] mod would be (or is). For example, let's say the scale of armor rating is as follows.
    10 rating = 10% damage resistance
    25 rating = 20% damage resistance
    50 rating = 40% damage resistance
    100 rating = 50% damage resistance
    200 rating = 60% damage resistance
    400 rating = 70% damage resistance
    If you have the [Pen] mod and strike a target with 25 rating (20% damage resistance) you would probably see a return in damage resistance debuff of 5~8% (you would reduce rating from 25 to 15). Now let's say you hit a target with 100 or 200 rating or even 400. You still ignore 10 of that rating but the return may be less than 1% because of strict diminishing returns. And I think this is how the [Pen] mod works but I could be wrong.
    The % based armor penetration traits from one of the C-Store Pilot ships and from the Delta reputation provide a solid % damage resistance debuff... regardless of the target's rating. So if you total actual 20% armor penetration with these two traits combined then you will always negate 20% resistance.
    Regardless of how it is you still have to look at the number of variables and parameters (or conditions) involved and decide for yourself what you are comfortable with relying or not relying on. Personally I like the [CritD] mod because I have such high critical chance and critical severity, and because it works in more scenarios than the [Pen] mod, and because I already have 20% solid armor penetration... and because I find that the [DMG] mod has strong merits but lacks sufficient wow factor (I know.. silly).
    EDIT:
    [CritD] is also significantly easier to increase (permanently and temporarily) with the numerous traits, consoles, BOFF abilities and specializations. It may be more expensive to get because of the number of things you need to get but only a select of those (consoles etc.) come with wasted other mods and stats. For this reason I think you will see bigger yields and returns from getting CritD. It is also very satisfactory to have like ~25 CritH and total 200%~ CritD. Arrays can for ~6000 damage unbuffed and torpedos can hit for 10 000-20 000 damage unbuffed. The CritD mod works brilliant with Beam Overload. By all means, FAW is great but if you don't want to aggro yourself to death in advanced and elite queues then BO is a strong option (and becomes even stronger with CritD).
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  • When it comes to Mods, CrtD vs. Dmg is a bit of a muddy issue.
    The fact is, you can't say for certain which one is better because it really depends on your build and other conditions. If you really want to go dig into all the math, I'm going to include some links to threads where you can dig into it, but in case you don't want to go through all that.. I'm just going to give you the bottom line honest truth.
    If you're not parsing your runs and trying to climb the DPS league charts, there is no difference between CrtD and DmG. They are equal in most situations, and even in situations where they differ it's by 1-3% tops. As a general rule (very general) if you're running a standing critical hit chance of 18% or lower, DmG is the slightly better mod. If your Critical chance is in that 20%+ range then CrtD gives you a slight advantage.
    Honestly though, the difference is still almost none. If you're trying to get every last single percent, then you're going to have to do some calculations to determine what's best for you. If you're not parsing runs and trying to get every single point, there is functionally no difference. As a general rule Pen is the best mod, followed by CrtD or Dmg.
    The only place you will notice a difference between CrtD and Dmg is in a parsing tool. Either mod will melt enemies in seconds and let you roll over most content like a hot knife through butter.
    You can find some math and more extensive discussion here,here, and here.
    As a general rule, I still prefer CrtD because I have a high critical chance, but if I am buying a Mark II weapon to upgrade, I go for Dmg because they sell for less then CrtD despite being equal.

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  • Frankly I think the best mod is the 'Classic VATS' mod or one of the ones that adds actual crafting.... oh wait yer talkin about procs
  • I use 2x CRDT X3,DMG & 2x CRDT,DMG X3, gives me good results.
    Tried using PEN but DPS went down ?????
  • Damaged buffed months ago, making those dmg*3 CritD ultra weapons a pretty attractive.

    Explains why the quad cannons have recently become more effective.
  • edited May 2016
    Yeah, Quad Cannons got a huge boost. As did the Fleet Beams with [CrtD][Dmg]x3.
    I run a full set of those Fleet Beams on one of my alts, took them to mark XIV, just left them at Ultra Rare. They're absolutely vicious, they deliver exceptional performance. They were pretty cheap to upgrade too, I did it during an Upgrade Weekend and they were dirt cheap.
    Ever since the revamp to the Dmg Mod, I'm a huge fan of the Fleet Beams.

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  • The factual answer to with weapon mod is best, is as explained by others...depends...on other variables of your build. However the TRUE answer is, whatever lets you have fun. Over and rapid mods are probably not that useful...but I like them because they are fun. I use to use dmg and critH mods a lot before the dmg boost because I had some effects that were triggered of crits and damage dealt and so that was fun. Seriously, this game is easy...have some fun.